Long ago I worked For Xerox. We had an entire department studying and working on "human factors", to incorporate into personal computers. What developed was a Graphic User Interface, first used in the Alto, and then the Xerox Star Windowing environment. They were as close to intuitive as you could get, and when they din't match your expectations they presented menu/options/shortcuts to teach you what was shown to be an "intuitive" way. This scheme was later stolen by apple and then Microsoft, who doled out incremental bits of it and developed by their own ways. You can blame both of those companies for doing it their way or the highway and not spend one cent on "human factors" or a human intuitive interface. And people keep buying into it, thinking there is no better way. It's just that the consumer will not pay the value add to help themselves, which is yet another very real "human factor".
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Update: It is now working. And I don't know what changed. ((Can't Use RX6R With XJT module in JR9303, 8103, or X-347 Transmitters. No channels 1-6)
- Thread starter LloydInAz
- Start date
So, I put the XJT in the Horus socket, powered it and bound it to an RX4R. Servos all work from stick input.
Moved the XJT to an 8103. The RX4R just flashes the red light as if there is no signal.
Re-bound the RX4R to the XJT (not sure why this is needed unless the PPM stream is unacceptable.)
REsult: red and green bind lights on and won't bind.
???
Moved the XJT to an 8103. The RX4R just flashes the red light as if there is no signal.
Re-bound the RX4R to the XJT (not sure why this is needed unless the PPM stream is unacceptable.)
REsult: red and green bind lights on and won't bind.
???
Konrad
Very Strong User
Then you know that GUI has nothing to do with the development of intuitive software. Its advantage was to those of us that couldn't type fast. A key skill needed when using command line instructions. I submit that command line instructions forces one to maintain a logical concise understanding of what one is trying to do in the CPU.
It is well understood that Xerox was the leader early in the development of GUI. It was a shame that Xerox's management could sell the idea. It took men like Jef Raskin and Steve Jobs to sell it (interface it with the personal computer). We can argue who stole what or was influenced by whom all day.
But to the concept of intuitive programing the GUI as seen with the desk top, files, folders and drives has NOTHING intuitive about it, if one has never dealt with a desk top, file, folders or any file organization scheme.
The last intuitive programing project I was exposed to was Jef Raskin's* "The Humane Interface".
Not sure how any of this has anything to do with your problems with the Horus and its file/instructional hierarchy.
All the best,
Konrad
*I flew with Jef Raskin in the last years of his life. He would some times use me as the unknowing user.
(To be clear. I had nothing to contribute to this other than have to wait, while he was on a conference call, to go flying with him).
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Konrad
Very Strong User
Maybe a cold solder joint with the pin block. This is a known issue with the JR module. Those long pins can flex breaking the solder joints.
I'm so confused. The RX4R stopped binding. Green and red lights say it is bind mode, never turning into a flashing red (it used to, though). So, it never finishes or actually binds. Switched back to my 9303 and another new in package XJT module. Still no bind on the RX4R. Took out a new in package RX6R...which was the origianal issue. It bound AND the servos drive from the TX controls! Moved the module to the 8103. The RX6R still functions as expected. Reinstalled the first XJT into the 9303. It bound to yet another RX6R, and servos drive fine. So, it seems now its all working as expected except for the only RX4R that I have. I don't know why, as the first try at 9303 and RX6R, would only drive from Channel 9 to RX channel 1 and I couldn't convince it otherwise. That first RX6R got bound to my Horus (after failing to operate with my 9303) which worked as you'd expect. I'm afraid to try it again. But, it now looks like I have a failed RX4R. And the original problem for this thread has somehow been inexplicably corrected. Which has left me quite confused. As a 30 year hardware engineer, I find this quite perplexing. It's as though microwaves are involved!?
I tried to bind the Horus with the RX4R. It will not bind. Same green and red lights and no complete bind.
I tried to bind the Horus with the RX4R. It will not bind. Same green and red lights and no complete bind.
The RX pins at outside board edges are signal pins. This had me guessing wrong at first. And about that. It says to jumper signal pin 1 And 2 to change FS/HS mode. But the label puts those at opposite ends of the edge connector. There is no way those included short jumpers can do that. So, it is either 1 and 4 that does it or you need a bridge jumper to go across the connector span. I can get a blue light if I use a 1-4 jumper. But never a flashing red bind complete on the RX4R. Cheers!
I edited my original post because I had forgotten that it is the XJT firmware that’s causing this issue and not the RX4R or RX6R firmware.
When I flash my XJT module with 141016 firmware, it sets the transmitter channels 1-4 to the PWM servo pins on my RX4R receiver by default. When I flash any newer version of firmware to the XJT module it sets the transmitter channels 9-12 to the PWM servo pins on my RX4R by default.
I am hoping this can be corrected by FrSky or Aloft hobbies as it would boost sales of the XJT modules and the RX4R receivers for those of us planning to use a non FrSky transmitter so we can enjoy all the benefits of ACCST v2.
Another edit:
If I bind the RX4R to the XJT module with the 141016 firmware, verify the channels 1-4 are working then update both the RX4R and the XJT module to the latest ACCST v2 firmware and DO NOT BIND the RX4R again, it remembers the bind and the 1-4 channel assignment. Not a simple way to use the system but I’d rather be using the latest version so that’s how I’ll be doing it.
When I flash my XJT module with 141016 firmware, it sets the transmitter channels 1-4 to the PWM servo pins on my RX4R receiver by default. When I flash any newer version of firmware to the XJT module it sets the transmitter channels 9-12 to the PWM servo pins on my RX4R by default.
I am hoping this can be corrected by FrSky or Aloft hobbies as it would boost sales of the XJT modules and the RX4R receivers for those of us planning to use a non FrSky transmitter so we can enjoy all the benefits of ACCST v2.
Another edit:
If I bind the RX4R to the XJT module with the 141016 firmware, verify the channels 1-4 are working then update both the RX4R and the XJT module to the latest ACCST v2 firmware and DO NOT BIND the RX4R again, it remembers the bind and the 1-4 channel assignment. Not a simple way to use the system but I’d rather be using the latest version so that’s how I’ll be doing it.
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MikeB
Very Strong User
This appears to be a bug in the V2 firmware for the XJT.
When binding using a PPM input signal and the bind button on the XJT module, it binds selecting channels 1-8 or 9-16 depending on what was last used when binding using the PXX protocol.
Unfortunately, the default when using PPM is to select channels 9-16.
So, a new XJT with V2 firmware if only used in a radio that outputs PPM will bind selecting channels 9-16.
If the XJT is bound using a PXX signal, and channels 1-8 are selected, then the XJT will then bind using channels 1-8 ad a PPM signal.
Either the firmware in the XJT needs to be changed so the default is channels 1-8, or perhaps dealers/FrSky need to try binding every XJT selecting channels 1-8 before they are shipped!
Since there is no feedback during bind, just putting the XJT into bind mode in a PXX capable transmitter should be sufficient.
Mike
When binding using a PPM input signal and the bind button on the XJT module, it binds selecting channels 1-8 or 9-16 depending on what was last used when binding using the PXX protocol.
Unfortunately, the default when using PPM is to select channels 9-16.
So, a new XJT with V2 firmware if only used in a radio that outputs PPM will bind selecting channels 9-16.
If the XJT is bound using a PXX signal, and channels 1-8 are selected, then the XJT will then bind using channels 1-8 ad a PPM signal.
Either the firmware in the XJT needs to be changed so the default is channels 1-8, or perhaps dealers/FrSky need to try binding every XJT selecting channels 1-8 before they are shipped!
Since there is no feedback during bind, just putting the XJT into bind mode in a PXX capable transmitter should be sufficient.
Mike
One more update:
Last week I bought 8 RX4R’s and 2 XJT modules. The first XJT module acted the way I have been experiencing with only the 141016 firmware resulting in channels 1-4 at the RX4R’s PWM output. Today I started binding to the second XJT module starting with ACCST v2.1.0 and to my surprise the channel assignment was correct. I suspect what Mike is saying is valid. If the bit is set correctly in the module, then the correct channel assignments will be remembered and set to each receiver bound to it.
Last week I bought 8 RX4R’s and 2 XJT modules. The first XJT module acted the way I have been experiencing with only the 141016 firmware resulting in channels 1-4 at the RX4R’s PWM output. Today I started binding to the second XJT module starting with ACCST v2.1.0 and to my surprise the channel assignment was correct. I suspect what Mike is saying is valid. If the bit is set correctly in the module, then the correct channel assignments will be remembered and set to each receiver bound to it.
Final update. I borrowed a friends FrSky Horus X10 transmitter and put my XJT modules in the JR/Graupner module slot. I used the menu to activate the bind mode for the XJT module and was able to select channels 1-8 with no telemetry. After I bound an RX4R receiver, I removed the XJT module from the Horus transmitter and put the module in my JR9303 and proceeded to bind to a different RX4R receiver. Instead of the receiver PWM outputs being channels 9-12 like they had been before, now they were channels 1-4. I repeated this test with similar results on 2 more RX4R receivers. Not intuitive but it’ll really simplify binding to 4 and 6 channel receivers in the future and having the correct channel assignments.
Thank you for your help Mike!
Thank you for your help Mike!
