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TopModel Samsara 3.2 meter glider, build thread on Aloft's Forum.

Konrad

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Suffer? What does Cumberland and aerotowing have to do with this?

Correction. My FVK Organic is a taco shell LE with fully wrapped Kevlar full depth shear web. The airfoil is a dated MH32 (pylon racing airfoil that works great for hunting thermals, low drag not a high lift airfoil). The wing is the same diminutional thickness as the Samsara but because of the shorter chord it has a higher percentage thickness.

The TopModel Samsara has a Drela airfoil and the LE sheeting does extent past the airfoils apex, per Drela's recommendations. My 3.2m FVK Organic is using the MH 32 with the taco shell LE ending at the high point of the airfoil.

Aerodynamically I like the TopModel Samsara with her Drela airfoils, after all it is about 2 decades more modern. The fuselage for the FVK Organic is only about 1.3 meters long vs the 1.8 meter long Samsara.

Yes the craftsmanship of my Topmodel models is far less impressive than that of my FVK models. I should hope so! I paid $1200 for the Organic in 1999 from NES In 1999 dollars. I think I paid $399 for the Samsara in 2018 but with 2018 dollars! My Samsara wing appears to be built with a hot glue. I think your Prelude is using a CA to attach the ribs to the carbon spar.

As to the Thermic Dream I think that is a 3m ship with an SD7012 airfoil (a modern RG15). If you load any of your 3 meter class carbon tube sparred ships to the same wing loading I think you will shocked at just how much better the smooth surfaced Thermic Dream will perform even on the flats with the wrong slope airfoil.

I just looked at some of my glider stash and can't find any carbon tube models. I know I don't like that kind of construction but I didn't think I was that discriminatory against it.

Samsara and FVK profiles.jpg

Samsara and organic center section.jpg

Samsara caps 23.jpg

FVK Organic spar.jpg
 
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Mike W

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My suffering was just a bit of NY humor! My long time flying buddy is at Cumberland aerotow this weekend (Ed has a 4,7m ASW20, a 4.7m Goldberg vintage S/P and a 6m DG800 I think?) where I would be if I had a scale ship ready. I thought you might like the video? I will be going there this summer.

On another note that 2.5m Cobra Wayne sent me I am using KST135mg servos in the wing and want to try Alofts twisted servo wiring but can't decide on 22 or 26ga and whether to go common bus? My runs will be shorter than your Samsara. If I go common bus I can use a micro four pin Deans instead of a Multiplex and keep the weight down?
Mike
 
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Konrad

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Glad to learn it was just humor. I feared I had turned you off the carbon tube wings. Now Wayne will tell you I'm an "engineering type". I hope that isn't a derogatory term.:rolleyes: But I'll take it to mean that if I see flaws and short comings I try to offer work arounds. Please when reading my posts don't think that my showing the limitation of a design I'm saying it is junk or of no value. Well, unless I say that straight out.

As the the wiring loom. I love the common bus bar!
As to wire size that depends on the peak not RMS power draw. As our radios pulse the power down the line this is critical. In the old days of the analog servo 20 ms or 50hz this wasn't too much of a problem. But now with 330 hz systems these peaks can easily stack up onto each other.

So back to your question how many servo will each bus bar be supplying? I think you said you were using Digital servo. If using more that 3 I'd go with the larger wire for the positive and negative leads. So my looms often look like they have 2 large +- wires and 2 to 4 thinner signal wires.

No I'm not trying to help Wayne with his wire sales. But get a run of large gage red and black twisted wire . Also get some thinner wire with a white and orange lead. I separate the large white wire from the red and black one. I also separate the white and orange wire from the lighter wire. I then twist (for noise cancilation reasons) the large red and black wire with the smaller white and orange. I know of no source of multi-gage 4 color wire.

Now the reason I do this isn't to cut down on the all up weight but rather to pull the weight out of the tip. The lighter the wings 9and their tips the better the wing is to signaling where the lift is!

Might I suggest you look at some of the modern 8 gram servo for your ailerons for this very reason. You can see that I'm using the small KST X0-8 for both the flaps and ailerons on my 2kg 3.2 meter 660 watt glider. While I don't think your glider can really benefit from the light weight flap servo I do think it would be a nice upgrade using lighter aileron servos.

Again this has nothing to do with all up weight but rather where the weight is kept. Keep it out of the wings and their tips!

Up and out,
Konrad
 
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Mike W

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Ok thanks, I'll consider the XO8's for the ailerons. Each bus will be supplying two digital servos and the span is only 2.5m probably the longest run is only 607-625mm? I did go with 22ga wire for the 3m Thermic Dream but am trying to keep the wire and conn. size to a minimum with this scale mid wing mount. The smaller the connector and wire the smaller hole I need to make in the wing root. Not planning on mounting the deans four pin connector, just pull through and connect.
 
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Konrad

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I was warned that I'm piling it on, saying the same things over and over again to make a forceful point. That was not my aim I apologize if anyone thought I was talking down to any member.

I see I said much the same thing much earlier. https://forum.alofthobbies.com/inde...d-thread-on-alofts-forum.125/page-3#post-1056

Today I think there is a more modern servo from KST. The X0-8 is not on my list of favorites.

Now I'm out,
Konrad
 
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