Ethos ( An intuitive program, my arse!)

[Konrad]

Just finish programing my first model with Ethos. I have to say I'm impressed!
Those that know me are well aware that Bits & Bites and myself don't get along. Or put another way I hate programing!

With that out of the way I decided to play a little mind game. Often I hear that the programing XX is intuitive. Now as an engineer and human (sometimes) I know there is no such thing as intuitive languages (programing or spoken). With Ethos I put this to the test. I tried to program my first model in Ethos without reading the manual!

Now I should give some background about my RC TX programing experiance. In the late 80's & 90's I felt I was rather comfortable with the Ace MicroPro 8000. I used 3 Futaba Super Sevens and never got comfortable with the master slave concept. I always had to go back to Don Edberg's manuals to do even the simplest of programing correction. Then got real comfortable and very happy with the Multiplex Profi 4000 with its object based output focused programing. Had to go backwards to master/slave with the Spektrum DX7 (first gen.) and DX9 with the move to 2.4ghz. Found OpenTX around 2016 and was so happy to again have an output based program structure similar to the great Multiplex Profi 4000.

As with all my learning I try to walk before I run. Here I chose to use a low emotional investment model, a Freewing Venom. This will be a 9ch model. I've been flying these for over a decade. This is a simple model when it come to mixing demands. I generally only need 3 mixes. To correct some knife edge issues, I use Rudder to Aileron and Rudder to Elevator mixes. And for a smooth take off run on concrete I like to decouple the nose gear steering to allow a rather extreme expo curve.

As I knew how to register and bind FrSky's ACCeSS that wasn't a fair test as to the intuitive nature of that part of the TX. Unlike the first gen. OpenTX and the Profi I found that Ethos had a very nice set up wizard. I also found the two flight mixes already set up in the pull down menus. With a little experimentation I got them to work with the dual ailerons just fine. The free mix for the nose gear was again similar to what I was use to with OpenTX or any of the modern TX programs. (Did not need to use a free mix as the rate and weight can be defined as in the initial channel set up menus. )
The only thing that gave me pause was looking for the dual rate and expo. Like OpenTX these function are a bit tedious as each switch position needs to be fully defined with the function you desire. (As Wayne said these can be set up directly in the mixer menus). This does hint to the power and flexibility of Ethos.

Overall programing this simple model without the manual was a lot less frustrating than I thought it would be. It did take about an hour of flailing around, but I did program the model without the manual. I'll now go back through this exercise with the manual to see if there are any hidden features that might make this basic programing more elegant. But for a first time through the program I'm happy to say I have an airplane program that I'm comfortable to fly with.

Next up for Ethos will be to play with curves and logic switches using Mike Shellim's F3F templets.

 

[Wayne]

Cool beanz.

I really love that curves and triple rates and expo etc are in the same mix page and or have a quick way to navigate to make changes to the curves. It is pretty easy to find what you are looking for.

Similar to OpenTX and long push in some areas will bring up a menu of options. Ethos is good at showing you when this is an option with a little icon next to that data entry point.

Heck, I needed to jump in to help setup some flaps on a model a while back. The builder had done things differently and I will say that I struggled to get things working correctly, but it was not an Ethos issue, it was my lack of understanding on how to achieve the goal. In the end it was one of those moments where you question why it took so long to figure out the solution. Sometimes these things happen.

 

[Konrad]

Great! I look forward to learning a more elegant way to setting up the dual rate and expo.

This is one of the things that is "fun" with programing, every time I write a program I find a cleaner, simpler or more elegant way to do things.

I was going through some of my older OpenTX programs and wondering why I did things the way I did them!

 

[Wayne]

I love that I can select one of the trims as the "weight" for a mix. This is how I adjust the flap to elevator mix in flight via the throttle trim. Works just like an elevator trim, so super easy to dial in on the first flight. I do the same for the aileron differential via the rudder trim. Once established, you can lock in the weight and use the trims for normal functions should you need them.

 

[Konrad]

Mike Shellim did that with most of his OpenTX templets. Is this a drop down menu option in Ethos?

 

[Wayne]

Yes, long push on the "weight" entry.

 

[Mucksmear]

Wayne had suggested I jump into the deep end against my intuition to start with a simple model setup. I ended up following the exceptional manual with its examples to set up my Alpina (6 servo wing plus rudder & elevator, but still much simpler than modern 6 servo wing setups). I found the programming to be so refreshing and such a relief after pounding my head against the Futaba 9c and its “manual” for the last 20-30 years. None of my planes are that complex but the Alpina is at the top.

My simplest plane is a 2 servo flying wing. Putting the aileron differential in a pot was another revelation of inspired setup I learned from the manual , especially in a flying wing where pitch coupling complicates matters and increases the risk of multiple test flights while sorting it out. One flight - twist the pot - you’re set!

 

[Konrad]

Next up in my learning progression is moving this rebuilt Taft Scorpion over to Ethos and the X-18. The issue I’m having is that this model uses a snap flap function (8mm of down flap) to induce wash out as up elevator is pulled. This works great with this airframe. Now what I want is to deaden (kill) this elevator to flap mix should I have more than 15% flap function (from left slider) . I assume it is a logic function, something like if X (slider) is less that 85% that camber mix is null . Where would I find such a set of instructions on how to do this?

Show us what you are working on..

That might make finding the glide portion a bit difficult. It is advised to keep power and lift/drag controls separate. Per the lift equation power is to overcome drag. Now with gliders we can't change the power variable but we can control the drag. So on the other side of the equation adding...

forum.alofthobbies.com

 

[Wayne]

Off the top of my head - I think you might have the logic statement setting a logic switch. Then have 2 ,mixes that are triggered by that logic switch. This would give you the different conditions and results.

There may be a more elegant way to do it, but that is what comes to my mind and should do the trick. Name the mixes so you will understand them later on.

 

[Konrad]

That is a BIG plus with Ethos, the naming of curves and mixes is much less restricted than OpenTX!

 

[Konrad]

I see with Spektrum I took the easy way out and programmed a 3 way switch as flight modes. I did away with any hope of using progressive flap. With Spektrum I had normal. This was set up as a snap flap (rigged wash out as I pulled the elevator. The mid position was take off flaps (fixed 15 degrees) and last was landing with full flaps (80+ degrees). This worked ok but did not give me any variability in the flap settings to match the wind conditions.

 

[Wayne]

With Ethos the biggest limitation is your own imagination.

 

[Konrad]

Well, that and how to implement that vision. Ethos is looking like it can do a lot of things a lot fast than OpenTx. I still tend to do things manually only to find that function can be done in a few “key” strokes.

 

[Konrad]

Found this CARE package from Aloft in my mailbox. In it is my Tandem RX. Looks like I’ll be able to maiden this Taft Scorpion on Friday. I’ve written the program as a 10ch model so the 10ch RX is perfect!

 

[Konrad]

OK, I'm lost. I'm looking to slow down the mix. In my flaps I have some elevator comp (8% at full flap 85°). Now the problem I see is that it takes time for the flap servo to move to the full down position. But the elevator comp only needs about 3° of servo rotation to compensate. So I'm likely to get a bit of a nose down input as the flaps try to catch up with the elevator comp. I'd like to slow down the comp to allow (follow) the flap motion. It is looking like I'll want about 0.15 to 0.2 second transit time for the 8% comp travel.

 

[Hawaii Sloper]

I believe you can adjust the speed of the servo, perhaps specific to that mix or function.

 

[Konrad]

Servo speed yes. But this is a primary flight control (elevator) so that’s the last thing I want.

I can’t find a mix speed. I found a delay but I’m looking for a rate function.

 

[Hill Hobbit]

Try the Delay. If works like Jeti (I don’t know) the delay in and out gives you the option to adjust a mix speed. It doesn’t mean a delay between switching a mode on or off and something happening, the delay time means the time the chosen surfaces take to get to their chosen positions and then back when the mix is switched off. This is for Jeti remember.

 

[Konrad]

Try the Delay. If works like Jeti (I don’t know) the delay in and out gives you the option to adjust a mix speed. It doesn’t mean a delay between switching a mode on or off and something happening, the delay time means the time the chosen surfaces take to get to their chosen positions and then back when the mix is switched off. This is for Jeti remember.

Thanks

I'll look into that. With OpenTX I've used delay when switch between flight modes. This time around I'm looking for mixer response. I like the hint about thinking about the end point not the starting point.

In the Output of Ethos I see a slow up, slow down setting. This look like a global servo setting. I'm loath to slow down a flight control servo. I'm trying to avoid pilot induced isolations (lead, lag issues).

FYI: Servo speed is the main performance value I look for. Torque is a secondary or even tertiary value in my servo selection process.

 

[Hill Hobbit]

Look at Mr D falling with style video on yt, he does one re flaps/elev compensation with slow.