Bringing back MOM racing!

[Red]

EDIT: Updated (June 19th, 2025) organization and class rules attached - these are getting very close to being final

Hey all!

There is a small but growing dedicated group that wishes to bring back MOM slope racing. The eventual goal is to gather enough participation to resurrect the ISR Unlimited Slope Races at Davenport, California, but for now, the idea is just to build interest in MOM racing in general.

The general idea is this: start with a series of fun, low-stress run-whatcha-brung type races throughout California to garner interest and then build from that. If folks in other areas are interested in hosting races...great! I'd love to travel a bit. I know of the Wilson Lake folks doing the 60" ODR stuff, we'd like to embrace and grow that, more on that later.

We feel that the way to make this work is it has to follow some criteria;

• Easy to do - not too many rules, plenty of airframes to choose from.
• Cheap - Encourage low dollar airplanes (kits, scratch built, printed, etc.) but not exclude moldies - more on this later.
• Emphasize fun - see the part about not too many rules.....

Initial thoughts:

• 60" span max
• xx oz/ft load limit - TBD
• Course length to be determined by the site/CD
• That's it!

All the 60" planes and pilots will be thrown in the same matrix. If a trend emerges, say moldies are dominating or a group of pilots are always at the top, we will break out into classes.

So to start, we'll focus on 60" planes. BUT... initially bring whatever and just show up and run the pylons!

July 12th, first race. See the signup thread elsewhere on this forum.

Potential Sites
NorCal

• Tick Point
• Los Banos
• Coyote Hills

SoCal

• Grass Mountain
• Others being identified

For me, I plan to champion an ODR design I'm working on https://forum.alofthobbies.com/index.php?threads/odr-designs.3838/. I'd love to see a low-cost option and people willing to build a bit again.

Who's in?
Red

 

[Twyl]

Love the idea. We had lots of fun down here in SoCal with our Speedo MoM races. I blame this guy named Wayne for instigating that mayhem.
Bummer the Speedo is no longer sold. That was a fun glider that was cheap enough that there was little fear in crashing it.

I understand the initial idea of just having fun (which is awesome), however when people are risking time and money they have invested into their build, I believe at least attempting to guarantee as even of a foundation as possible could help boost participation. While dictating wing length & weight help a bit, airfoil and wing shape also play a huge roll in how fast a particular model flies. Perhaps a model like the Spin would be a good option, or maybe specifying a specific wing (i.e. length, airfoil, taper) either supplied by Aloft or simply have files available for folks to cut, could be an option as well.

-Jon

 

[Yotaman1985]

Sounds awesome!

 

[thenated0g]

Any videos of this kind of race?

 

[Doc James Hammond]

Hey all!

There is a small but growing dedicated group that wishes to bring back MOM slope racing. The eventual goal is to gather enough participation to resurrect the ISR Unlimited Slope Races at Davenport, California, but for now, the idea is just to build interest in MOM racing in general.

The general idea is this: start with a series of fun, low-stress run-whatcha-brung type races throughout California to garner interest and then build from that. If folks in other areas are interested in hosting races...great! I'd love to travel a bit. I know of the Wilson Lake folks doing the 60" ODR stuff, we'd like to embrace and grow that, more on that later.

We feel that the way to make this work is it has to follow some criteria;

• Easy to do - not too many rules, plenty of airframes to choose from.
• Cheap - Encourage low dollar airplanes (kits, scratch built, printed, etc.) but not exclude moldies - more on this later.
• Emphasize fun - see the part about not too many rules.....

Initial thoughts:

• 60" span max
• xx oz/ft load limit - TBD
• Course length to be determined by the site/CD
• That's it!

All the 60" planes and pilots will be thrown in the same matrix. If a trend emerges, say moldies are dominating or a group of pilots are always at the top, we will break out into classes.

So to start, we'll focus on 60" planes. BUT... initially bring whatever and just show up and run the pylons!

No dates yet, but please show your interest here.

Potential Sites
NorCal

• Tick Point
• Los Banos
• Coyote Hills

SoCal

• Grass Mountain
• Others being identified

For me, I plan to champion an ODR design I'm working on https://forum.alofthobbies.com/index.php?threads/odr-designs.3838/. I'd love to see a low-cost option and people willing to build a bit again.

Who's in?
Red

Me from afar!

Doc.

 

[jakem]

I'm in!

 

[Red]

Any videos of this kind of race?

These are open class planes.....but the idea is the same.

 

[Hawaii Sloper]

That looks pretty exciting! So it’s just 2 people racing at a time? (Thus the MOM title I guess?)
I have exactly half of the amount of people here in Kona to be able to do MOM Hawaii!

 

[OribaSJ88]

Hey all!

There is a small but growing dedicated group that wishes to bring back MOM slope racing. The eventual goal is to gather enough participation to resurrect the ISR Unlimited Slope Races at Davenport, California, but for now, the idea is just to build interest in MOM racing in general.

The general idea is this: start with a series of fun, low-stress run-whatcha-brung type races throughout California to garner interest and then build from that. If folks in other areas are interested in hosting races...great! I'd love to travel a bit. I know of the Wilson Lake folks doing the 60" ODR stuff, we'd like to embrace and grow that, more on that later.

We feel that the way to make this work is it has to follow some criteria;

• Easy to do - not too many rules, plenty of airframes to choose from.
• Cheap - Encourage low dollar airplanes (kits, scratch built, printed, etc.) but not exclude moldies - more on this later.
• Emphasize fun - see the part about not too many rules.....

Initial thoughts:

• 60" span max
• xx oz/ft load limit - TBD
• Course length to be determined by the site/CD
• That's it!

All the 60" planes and pilots will be thrown in the same matrix. If a trend emerges, say moldies are dominating or a group of pilots are always at the top, we will break out into classes.

So to start, we'll focus on 60" planes. BUT... initially bring whatever and just show up and run the pylons!

No dates yet, but please show your interest here.

Potential Sites
NorCal

• Tick Point
• Los Banos
• Coyote Hills

SoCal

• Grass Mountain
• Others being identified

For me, I plan to champion an ODR design I'm working on https://forum.alofthobbies.com/index.php?threads/odr-designs.3838/. I'd love to see a low-cost option and people willing to build a bit again.

Who's in?
Red

Thanks for putting out that summary, Red. Looks awesome and is a great start!

Red, Doc and I remember the "prehistoric" times of slope racing when there was only Man-on-Man slope racing. There was no F3F. It was a blast--as exciting for spectators as it was for pilots. There's no better example of the excitement, and the agony, than the video Red shared.

Until we get some community input on what the rules should be, we'd like to make the first (few) races a "Bring What Ya Got and Race" kind of event, just as Red said. The event is as much for first timers as for racing veterans. It'll just be some friendly competition.

I'm a big fan of an affordable 60" class of MOM racing. I agree that it's absolutely the right way to get started. Let me throw out a few options:

• ODR Class: I've attached the rules here. Red's design would be one example of such a racer. Limits on geometry, weight, airfoils.
• Single Racer "Kit": This define a single, readily available kit allowed. The Spin, as mentioned above. Perhaps a 3D-printed design. There would be limits on modification and weights.
• Any 60" Racer: Just as the name implies, any racer 60" or less. The only restriction would likely be wing loading. Could possible be a more advanced class once things get rolling

While we discuss what the class should look like, where would you guys like the first event(s) to be held? Here's my take on the sites in the Bay Area

• Coyote Hills: A regional park in Newark, FRIA. A bit of a hike from parking. Slope not easiest a race course setup, but possible. Many hikers to avoid.
• Los Banos: Great slopes, FRIA, easy access. Unsure about the reliability of winds during the summer months.
• Thornton Beach: In Daly City just south of SF. Fairly consistent winds in summer. Decent landing area. A bit of a hike to the slope.
• Big Creek Lumber: Davenport , north of Santa Cruz. Only if access can be arranged. Easy access. Site of original International Slope Race
• Tick Point: I have not visited the site

I hope you guys will come out and join us. Let's race!

Ollie

 

[OribaSJ88]

That looks pretty exciting! So it’s just 2 people racing at a time? (Thus the MOM title I guess?)
I have exactly half of the amount of people here in Kona to be able to do MOM Hawaii!

If there are enough pilots and helpers, there can be as many as four sailplanes racing at one time--though that number is whatever gets decided once we have some rules. It can make for some, ahem, rekitting of hardware

 

[Wayne]

For the buiilt up class I think the ODR rules are a good option. They are well tested and work. People like the planes and love the races. The existing ODR models tends to be strong enough to take some abuse.

God knows we had a ton of fun with the very small Speedos. A 60 is that much more fun.

Please remove Tick from possible locations. It is not a great site for that, and really do not want to put that site at risk. It is the only legal glider site I know of on National Park land. As a result it tends to be watched by those that want it closed.

I can talk with Atrur about making a special versioin of the Spin or Elf just to meet ODR. We can then sell them cheap, but only to folks that have attended a race. (We sold a lot of Speedos at no profit just for racing, but many never showed for a race.)

 

[Doc James Hammond]

For the buiilt up class I think the ODR rules are a good option. They are well tested and work. People like the planes and love the races. The existing ODR models tends to be strong enough to take some abuse.

God knows we had a ton of fun with the very small Speedos. A 60 is that much more fun.

Please remove Tick from possible locations. It is not a great site for that, and really do not want to put that site at risk. It is the only legal glider site I know of on National Park land. As a result it tends to be watched by those that want it closed.

I can talk with Atrur about making a special versioin of the Spin or Elf just to meet ODR. We can then sell them cheap, but only to folks that have attended a race. (We sold a lot of Speedos at no profit just for racing, but many never showed for a race.)

Virtual sponsorship - that's good. If it comes off, I'll be chipping in too.

60" for a kick-off is great, but I'm personally looking forward to the Great Aloft Hobbies Open International Slope Race, of course...Or even the Great Aloft/Aeroic Open International Slope Race...In that case, I'd drag people from Europe at least, and probably Asia too.

Hint hint...nudge nudge... Say no more! (Thanks Eric)

Doc

 

[Doc James Hammond]

OK, I posted about the ODR rules, but I may have been a bit too forceful. So I evaporated the post - sorry about that if I was over the top, but I think the ODR rules are exactly why people don't do MOM racing.

You need to be able to use something you have, something you wanted to buy anyway, some cobbled-together Franken Racer from the gutpile bin, flying wings, canards or just something easy to conjure up - preferably to your own design, but a design that fits the rules: i.e. 60" span and not too heavy.

The rules should be just as Red suggested:

• 60" span max
• xx oz/ft load limit - TBD (JH) Just use FAI rules?
• Course length to be determined by the site/CD
• That's it!

Honestly, people should be encouraged to use strange wing shapes, to use any section they like, and make their dream 60" racer as long as it's safe to race.

I, for one, would not like to be bound by a dozen paragraphs of rules for a simple 60" slope race - honestly, ODR is worse than the FAI requirement. This is FUN racing, not steely-eyed, deadly, serious F3f...

My two cents' worth.

Doc..

 

[MBR]

I would love to see interest in the MoM races get rekindled!
I would keep it simple, maybe a beginner Foamy 60" class and a Open 60" class? Pretty much as Red and others have suggested.
Internal ballast only for both classes and determine a maximum all up weight . If someone wants to fly something smaller or different, no Problem! #1 rule, Keep it fun and easy to join in the fun!
Then perhaps, we can get an ISR type race going again with F3F type moldies again!

Look forward to helping get a race program going again!
Mike Retterer

 

[Doc James Hammond]

I would love to see interest in the MoM races get rekindled!
I would keep it simple, maybe a beginner Foamy 60" class and a Open 60" class? Pretty much as Red and others have suggested.
Internal ballast only for both classes and determine a maximum all up weight . If someone wants to fly something smaller or different, no Problem! #1 rule, Keep it fun and easy to join in the fun!
Then perhaps, we can get an ISR type race going again with F3F type moldies again!

Look forward to helping get a race program going again!
Mike Retterer

Good one, Mike - the more the better!

Doc.

 

[OribaSJ88]

After a consultation with Red, we'd like to set a tentative date and time for the first MOM Race.

• Date: Saturday July 12th, 2025
• Site: Los Banos Reservoir
• CDs: Red & Ollie

After discussing the options and personal schedules, Los Banos made the most sense. It has good access, it's easy enough to setup the course and can accommodate multiple different wind directions. We will have to content will summer weather patterns and the possibility of inconsistent winds, but it's the worth the risk for the benefits.

As Red said in the first post, the theme of the event will be "bring whatever and just show up and run the pylons!'. If you have a 60" ODR racer, that's great. A 60" molded racer, check. If you wanna smoke the competition with an 3m F3F beast, bring it! Participation is more important than the plane you race with. The emphasis is going to be on fun and re-introducing MOM racing to those who may not be familiar with the class. We'll work on a more equitable set of rules as time goes on.

I'll setup another thread for signups of those interested in participating. Come and join us for a day of MOM racing.

Ollie

 

[Wayne]

Sounds good - And the more I think of it, the more I agree with not following the ODR as it forces folks into a given style of plane. I do like to encourage folks to bring what they have, and create what they want. That is the goal of racing anyhow.

July in Banos - Yikes.. Going to be hot.

Might sound silly, but maybe add Weldon to the list of possible sites.

For flagging, we going to use volunteer (or not flying racers) with flags? That was all the more we did for Speedo races and it was fine.

I'd like to propose #1 rule. You gots to be hav'n fun!

Drama free racing! You start bitching about a flag call or someone else's plane, etc, you are encouraged to read rule #1.

 

[OribaSJ88]

Good one, Mike - the more the better!

Doc.

The discussion is great. Over the years, I've seen various attempts to bring new pilots into slope racing, some better than others. If the events were too simplistic or too restrictive, it's hard to maintain interest and the new pilots don't always develop the skills to advance to the next level. I think it's important that the more experienced pilots still want to participate in the same class and their participation helps the new comers improve. Here's my two cents:

• The ODR Rules seem like a well proven starting point that has earned a solid following
  • Limiting the size, weight, airfoils provides an even playing field for newbies and can still be interesting enough for a more experienced pilot. I hope class doesn't need a beginner and advanced breakout. We shall see
  • I'd love to see a largely prefabricated option, along the lines of the Spin or Elf. Many, myself included, just don't have a good workshop for assembly.
  • I'd like to entertain some updates to rules as they stand
    • Moulding is out, but I'd like to consider allowing 3D-printed models. It is gaining in popularity and a 3D-printed ODR design would be straight forward enough. The tech yields an inexpensive airframe (~$40), it's quick to assemble but fragile using common materials (PLA, PETG). Perhaps an industrious builder could make the 3D-printed components and related hardware available as a kit to those who'd like to go this route. It may be the fastest way to get a few tens of airframes out to the pilots.
    • Ailerons, but no separate flaps seem right. But, allow a pilot to have a rudder if he wants it (it usually doesn't help that much at this size)
    • Radios have advanced A LOT since when these rules seem to have been written
      • Allow snap flaps, spoilerons/flaperons for landing with elevator mixing for pitch compensation
      • Make radio templates available (think bind-n-fly) to make setup easier for beginners. Provide for a few common radios (FrSky, Spectrum...)
• An unlimited class of 60"
  • Whether this class is available from day one or not, I think it's important to have an advanced class to move up to. It also maintains interest among more advanced pilots
  • The intermediate pilot should be able to use the same ODR sailplane from above to start competing--though it may not be terribly competitive
  • Other than wing span, 60", and a max loading (FAI max, 24 oz/sq-ft?), are there other restrictions? As Doc said, the idea is to innovate in this space
• A truly unlimited class of MOM Racing
  • This is the holy grail of MOM racing. Let's call it a stretch goal.
  • FAI limits. Anything else?
  • This will depend entirely on interest and participation and won't be included in the beginning.

These are just my thoughts and suggestion. Let's keep the discussion and ideas coming and hopefully we can agree on a rule set the works well.

Ollie

 

[OribaSJ88]

Sounds good - And the more I think of it, the more I agree with not following the ODR as it forces folks into a given style of plane. I do like to encourage folks to bring what they have, and create what they want. That is the goal of racing anyhow.

July in Banos - Yikes.. Going to be hot.

Might sound silly, but maybe add Weldon to the list of possible sites.

For flagging, we going to use volunteer (or not flying racers) with flags? That was all the more we did for Speedo races and it was fine.

I'd like to propose #1 rule. You gots to be hav'n fun!

Drama free racing! You start bitching about a flag call or someone else's plane, etc, you are encouraged to read rule #1.

Wayne,

All good points. Two thumbs up on the fun factor. Clearly you've been to a slope race or two, before . You had me sold on ODR as a starting point. I'll let you read my other post and see what you think. Getting new pilots into slope racing was tough. Some never graduated from sportsman and, when or if they did, they'd get smoked in unlimited because they often didn't have good sailplanes or hadn't developed good racing skills.

Los Banos is an imperfect choice and, yeah, it could be sweltering. The only other site with easy access is Davenport. Assuming we could get access, it works best if there are a few dedicated flaggers at the far pylon--it's a trek. Depending on how many pilots show up, we may all be pilots, callers and flaggers. Every pilot requires 3 additional people. The math gets tough unless there is lots of participation.

Ollie

 

[Curdman]

I’m down.
scott